HEATHER:
Hello everyone. Here we are again for another Mavens Do It Better podcast. I am here with Raya Dukhan, a very dear friend. I'm so excited to have her on today. She is coming to us from Brooklyn, from New York city. Hey Raya.
RAYA:
Woohoo. Hello.
HEATHER:
Hello. so yeah, Raya and I were actually just together recently when I came through New York back from the European SharePoint Conference and got a chance to catch back up. And she's a place where I hang out in New York city when I go there. It's been how many years have you been in New York now?
RAYA:
Uh, 2003.
HEATHER:
2003. That's right. So a long time.
RAYA:
A long time, yeah. Been in My place now since 2006.
HEATHER:
Oh my gosh, that's amazing. Raya, y'all, she is gosh art maven graphics maven. So many things. And I wanted to have her on to talk a little bit about art and talk about her journey becoming an artist and how that happened and Raya, like when I was at your place and when I'm always at your place. Your apartment is just full of beautiful paintings that you have done.
RAYA:
Thank you.
HEATHER:
Absolutely. did you, you do open studios there?
RAYA:
I do. I have hosted two open studios at my place in the last two years or actually two in the last two years and another one back in 2008 with the same group.
HEATHER:
What’s the group that you do those with?
RAYA:
Uh the Park Slope Windsor Terrace Group. And then I also am part of the Gowanus artists community and I have done two open studios with them in the last two years at a different place.
HEATHER:
Right. And open studios for those of you who don't know, it's where artists open up either their homes or their atelier or fancy word for a workplace, I guess. And, and so Raya's had people come in and, and so her I think your apartment was kind of decked out for the last one, right? So you had a lot of stuff hanging on the walls.
RAYA:
Definitely more than last time. But I also ended up rearranging everything kind of in preparation of doing more of these, so yes. The place has definitely come a long way and being an art gallery, home studio.
HEATHER:
Right. So, you we, we always, we always talk about Raya as our Russian and will you talk about your humble beginnings, where you started with art and where you grew up a little bit so everybody can hear that?
RAYA:
Sure. So I did, I was born in St Petersburg, Russia and came here with my family in when I was nine years old in 1979. We moved to New York where we were, we were for a year. And then my family moved to Chicago. And as far as my art world goes, that is where, we moved to Rogers Park, East Rogers park, and in our, in our building we had a neighbor friend, her name is Jan, who introduced me basically to arts and painting as she was studying arts in downtown Chicago. And I became kind of, you know, just became really into it and going to see her at that place and just being part of that world. And starting to take my own lessons with her in the same studio in downtown Chicago.
HEATHER:
Yeah. That's cool. It's so funny. So, everybody, Raya is also friends with Alison Gerlach who was also on the podcast and many others that have been on. And so we, you know, we have a circle of friends that sort of, I think we followed each other all over the place, like some to New York, some to Seattle, some to Chicago and Allison's now in Rogers park. And then I grew up in Chicago and you did a lot of you did a, I think a summer internship that was affiliated with the art Institute of Chicago. A place that I love and used to drive to when I was 16 and would steal the car and I wouldn't go to the mall. I would go to the art Institute. And so will you tell everybody a little bit about that and how that was for you?
RAYA:
Sure. so in high school I went to high school in Chicago as well. I had my teacher at the time basically submitted me to, to this residency program. She submitted a few of us and I was accepted and I think it was a sophomore year between sophomore year and junior year of high school. I attended the Oxbow residency program, which is in Saugatuck, Michigan. About three hours from Chicago. And I spent a couple of weeks there enjoying painting and you know, just being completely immersed in that world. And side note, I went to Saugatuck again last summer with my family as a little trip for my parents' anniversary, 40th anniversary. So I went back and checked out this place that was so important to me at the time and
HEATHER:
Oh yeah. That's so cool. Yeah, I think I went to Saugatuck for a weekend with a boyfriend in high school if I remember correctly but yeah, but I'm from Michigan. Yeah.
RAYA:
It's beautiful. It's like a little boating village. Now it's just, you know, full of art galleries and all this vibe. I don't know if I remember that from back in those days, but yeah, it's a nice little town.
HEATHER:
Right. That's super cool. And I know that, you know, you and I talk a lot about business as well and you've had the juxtaposition of, you know, being an artist, I was a theater major and then both of us getting into technology in different ways. And you know, me on the marketing side, you more on the graphics and all of that. How did that come about for you?
RAYA:
Totally by accident. I was I was living out in Port Townsend, Washington where I ended up a few years after college and it's a beautiful town that's about two and a half hours away from Seattle on the peninsula and it's, you know, like full of artists and boat makers and writers and lack of jobs was a problem. So I was looking, I spent a bunch of time looking in Port Townson. I had some really odd jobs, heavy on the odd and then I was looking
HEATHER:
How odd were they Raya?
RAYA:
Yes, don't get me started. And then I ended up in Seattle where it was definitely further, you know, it would've been a really long commute, but I was kind of getting a little desperate because I'm in my mid-twenties at this point. And I kinda could use a real job. So I was cat sitting for a friend and interviewing. And then I ended up in Pioneer Square in downtown Seattle and walked into this job, was interviewed by a lovely woman who's one of my best friends now. And started working as an office type of person for a multimedia company called Free Range Media. That was the introduction. That was in 1994.
HEATHER:
Gosh, right time.
RAYA:
I know. So I was basically the office part, you know, ended. I was, you know, that had to go. Side note, you know who took over my job as an office admin? You probably know him from the theater world. Basil Harris.
HEATHER:
No way.
RAYA:
Yes. He took over my office gig at free range media and I was, you know, about a few months into my gig. I was doing HTML and then that was really fun and cool. And well look at that. I write this and it becomes on the worldwide web. I'm so cool. And then you know, my graphics or my design background and my art background sort of drifted me into doing more graphic design work for them. So I started working in a children's division of free-range called free zone. And yeah. And I was working on a kids community doing, you know, basically a kid's site and a kid's community site for several years.
HEATHER:
I love that I get to learn so much about people that I know really well too. I was like, I'm like, what? You did who and Basil? That stuffs hilarious.
RAYA:
I thought you would know him.
HEATHER:
Yeah, totally. We worked together many times with open circle and theater schmeeter and lots of that back in the early, late nineties, early two thousands when I was, when I had a theater company in Seattle called Grex.
RAYA:
Yeah. Oh, wow. Yeah, no, he's still, you know, I follow him on Instagram. Still huge in the theater world and doing stuff and looks exactly the same by the way.
HEATHER:
Not fair.
RAYA:
We took a fun trip to San Francisco once, another whole like crazy story. But yeah, he was, we became good friends and
HEATHER:
That's awesome.
RAYA:
He was working at the Space Needle at the same time too. He was like the elevator operator. Talk about odd jobs.
HEATHER:
Yeah, really, how odd were they? That's so cool. Well, and you know, in the juxtaposition of all of that too you, like I have a travel bug and I know that in between, you know, artist jobs and graphic jobs and sort of figuring out where you want to live and all of that, you've done a lot of traveling and some of that's been artist in residency and other things. Will you talk a little bit about that, that bug and where that bit you maybe the first time?
RAYA:
Oh, okay. Sure. so I was always interested in, you know, faraway places and moving out to Washington state on my own was really the first time I was kind of on my own and I started doing some small trips, like just, you know, like British Columbia and just, you know, Western Washington and Portland. And then I just decided, you know, I need to take like three months and I need to travel Europe, you know, just get on, get a Eurail and just do it. Like, you know, I'm 27 years old. I need to do this. So I quit my, I think it was free range media at the time. I quit free range and I just bought a ticket and a Eurail pass and spent three months traveling around Europe. And I've did that several times, not to Europe. But did that several times with Southeast, Southeast Asia while I was living in Seattle. Also, you know, jobs in the tech world in the 90s were like, you know, you walk in and you just get a job. It's really, it wasn't really that hard. Or you're at a party and someone poaches you, you're like, okay, I guess I have a job on Monday? I was just sipping my glass of wine. You want to put me to work? Okay. I'll take the money.
HEATHER:
For sure. Those were the days in many respects, but yeah.
RAYA:
Yeah.
HEATHER:
Well, and I'm curious about, so like throughout this whole time though, and I mean one going to Europe and sort of, did you do the whole, like museumy thing where you like went and visited the masters and all of that kind of stuff and sorta took all that in as well?
RAYA:
Yeah, I did everything. I really did. I, you know, I stayed in like youth hostels and I went to museums. I went to beaches, like, you know, did all the parties. I really kind of did it all. Anything that you know, I w I was by myself the first three big trips. So it was, you know, you have to kind of make friends unless you don't want to be alone all the time. So yeah, that was, that was what I did. It was before, you know, you know where everybody's on their phone in these kinds of places. Like now you go to a hostel, it's like, Oh, I just get to watch, sit around and watch a bunch of people on their phones. That's really fun.
HEATHER:
Yeah. Well, and we used maps, right. And there was no GPS, there was no Yelp or whatever. You know, it was definitely a different time of, you know, having a map, trying to figure out where you're going and I agree with you, you know, you go into any bar or restaurant or whatever and everybody's kind of looking around to like be like, who can I talk to and who can I share something cool with? Because you know, you're not sharing it digitally yet, you know, in those days. For sure. So
RAYA:
No, and I kind of miss that. I did some traveling recently and I'm like, Oh well glad I have my phone because no one else was talking to me.
HEATHER:
Oh I know, I know you've got to break through the glass wall of the smartphone. That is for sure. Oh my gosh. And then, and then there was a call to New York city, which makes my heart thump in a way as, and the energy there is like nothing else. So what, what were you, did you always think I'm going to live in New York at some point?
RAYA:
No, I don't actually remember liking New York very much when we were there for a year in 79. I remember dirty, I even had this like skin rash that I got like swimming in the ocean at Brighton beach as a kid. It's like, no, I don't think I'm going back there. And then one day I woke up and I'm like, I'm in Seattle. Like I think I'm gonna move to New York. And then literally like half a dozen of my friends that same time period like, I'm going to move New York too. Let's do it. I'll be your roommate. So all of a sudden like all like my Seattle friends just moved to New York with me, which was fantastic, you know, so I didn't have to navigate the city alone and got to do all the fun things and experience everything. And I had friends to do it with, which was, you know, you can't ask for more than that.
HEATHER:
Yeah, absolutely. I kind of remember that time cause there was a mass Exodus from Seattle by a bunch of theater people and like, you know, you knew a ton of theater people, artist people, tech people and stuff and so like, yeah, a lot of those same people. I knew. Yeah, that was like the early two thousands, I think it was like everybody, I felt like everybody was moving to New York
RAYA:
Last one turn off the lights is what we used to say.
HEATHER:
Oh my gosh, that's so funny. And you and I do you want to talk about where you and I met?
RAYA:
Sure. we met at burning man. Was it two thousand three or four?
HEATHER:
Four was my first year, so it would've been 2004 vaults of heaven. Yes.
RAYA:
I thought it was three, but wow. All right.
HEATHER:
Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, so Raya and I met out in the desert at the largest art exhibit in the world. I don't know about you, I still feel, you know, like definitely college dear friends, but Burning Man is for me, has been a place where I have made the closest, dearest friends in the world that are from all kinds of industries, all walks of life, everything that you know, our group of people that we know are just amazing. So
RAYA:
Absolutely. I would completely agree. And still, you know, majority of my friends in New York that is, you know, our history, our roots. I, I, when I moved here in 2003 I quickly joined the local burning man community and you know, met a ton of people. All Of a sudden I had like 200 new friends, you know, and we would do all the things, you know, do all the activities around town and it was, you know, it's been a blast and you can always tap into that. I mean, I'm obviously, my life now is quieter and I'm doing more, you know, working at home and that kind of thing, but if I want to do this, you know, it's easy to find.
HEATHER:
Yeah, yeah, it's there. Yeah. That's the cool thing about, you know, burning man was really centered at, you know, in the black rock desert in Nevada. But I, but the regional burns and the regional just communities are so huge and it is one of those things I feel like with, for me, like the tech community is like that too. Like, I can go anywhere in the world and I can tap into my tech community from Microsoft and SharePoint and all of that. And I can tap into my burner community and all I have to do is be like, I'm in town and it's like dinner, whatever. You know, like it's, it's such a cool thing to have that kind of connection with people that you're like, yep, okay, you're a tech person, you’re a SharePointer or you're a burner, let's do it. You know? And,
RAYA:
And there's so much overlap, you know, especially these days. The tech, the tech and burning man is kind of like so intertwined. For better or for worse. But
HEATHER:
Yeah, I know. In going back, I hadn't been back in five years and I went this last year as you know, with Alison and worked for the burning man organization. And the thing that got me the most was the change of led lights. Like five years ago Led light systems weren't really, it was just the beginning of that. And it was L wire and glow sticks. Right. That's what we had to work with.
RAYA:
They were constantly breaking in the dust. You know, my wires are splitting. And of course, you know, you're like in the middle of the desert. Okay, I guess I have no lights.
HEATHER:
I know completely. But I was like, it is so bright here. Like everything is lit up with like fancy LEDs. Like you have in a light bulb at your house. I was just like, I was mesmerized. I was like, Oh my goodness, this is bananas. So good. It's funny, but yes,
RAYA:
Well, haven't been since 2010. I have not seen this.
HEATHER:
Are you going to go back?
RAYA:
You know, I don't know. I mean, I keep thinking I will.
HEATHER:
Yeah. One day you'll come.
RAYA:
When was the last time you were there before this past year?
HEATHER:
I think it was five years ago. So yeah, 2013, 14 something like that. Yeah.
RAYA:
Well I remember you were there in my last year.
HEATHER:
Yeah. Yes, I will. That's right. Yes we did. That's right. Absolutely. Oh my goodness. And you know, I, so meeting at burning man and then, you know, that is the largest, I think, one of the largest art installations in the world. And I love your painting. And will you tell everybody a little bit about sort of where you get your ideas and talk about, and it's hard sometimes to express in words what paintings look like or what your medium is, but would you share a little bit about that with everybody too?
RAYA:
Sure. well I feel like I should give a little bit of a history as I’m kind of summarizing it. I've been preoccupied with wabi-sabi, which is a Japanese philosophy that's been around since like the 15th century.
HEATHER:
Oh, just that.
RAYA:
Just that. And it's all You need to know. Silence. Pin drop.
HEATHER:
Totally.
RAYA:
Do you, are you familiar with it?
HEATHER:
I know like that it's a philosophy and that it's sort of simplicity, like simplicity, the love of simplicity is what I know. So please, please elaborate. So, yeah, tell us all about it.
RAYA:
No, it's actually simplicity is what's sort of kind of went into. So the design world, which is like, you know, your interior design is, it's even penetrated the interior design world. Which I just realized recently the, you know, the simplicity aspect. But what I love is the imperfection. The, the incomplete, the impermanent, that kind of aspect of this philosophy. I'm a huge fan of unintentional art, you know, like, like rusted out cars or you know, you're in a subway and you see this poster, I don't even know what you'd call it, but it's like layers and layers of posters ripped up and, and what the texture that creates or being in an old building and the paints the chipping away. Like, I love that, you know, I know that it's not intentional, but definitely, definitely something that's near and dear to me. And I, I feel like that's, that's the preoccupation with my own work, this particular manipulation of the canvas. So it's, it has these texture, texture that, you know, they could be removed and added and depending on, you know, what I'm feeling or you know, what's, what's going in my head, it could be something that I could add color to and remove colors. So it's just constantly growing, kind of like, you know, living and breathing piece of, you know, whatever. You know, it's just like there and it's not there. So and I know that there's a lot of, I know you probably are like, well what about all the color? Cause I know that every time you were in my apartment you're like, well this place is so bright.
HEATHER:
Well it's bright, but it's muted though too though. You know, like you use a lot of really rich deep colors in your painting. Purples and blues.
RAYA:
I do and I go in between. I mean, I think the colors, like I also get bored easily, you know, like I want to do things that are much more colorful. Also, you know, depending on like let's say if I was just traveling in central America, you know, I'm going to come back and my, my palette has all these new colors in it, you know. And that's what I'm thinking and breathing. But yeah, definitely, you know, the, the, the New York winter, I tend to go a little more, you know, subdued. Definitely though, what's around me is part of part of what comes out in my work.
HEATHER:
Yeah, absolutely. You know, who's work I was looking at recently and I was thinking about you was Mark Bradford. Do you know him?
RAYA:
I feel like I do know him.
HEATHER:
Yeah. He does this, He's got the paper
RAYA:
He was recently at Hauser & Wirth.
HEATHER:
Yeah, he, yeah, he does like all the paper and then rips it often and stuff. He's got a bunch of stuff here in LA at the Brode. That's kind of really cool. But I was thinking,
RAYA:
Oh, yeah. I just pulled up his link. Yeah, I actually , so lately what I've been doing is, um, for my own, you know, just research and learning is I'm, I'm starting to spend more time looking at other artist's work. And he was actually on my list. I even had a link of his work right at my fingertips. Hauser & Wirth is actually one of my favorite galleries here in New York. And he's, I don't know when his show here was, but I, I believe I went to it, but yes. He lives in LA.
HEATHER:
Yeah, he does. And you know how I found out about, about him, I was literally with my mom and dad and they're like, there's a 60 minutes on this guy that I think you're going to love. They watch 60 minutes religiously and so, and also jeopardy. And so, we were playing jeopardy of course with Alex and then we watched 60 Minuets and he was on.
RAYA:
You're like, Whoa.
HEATHER:
Yeah, totally. No, it's totally funny and hilarious. I love it.
RAYA:
Definitely love his work. Yeah, no, and it's also quite in line with what I'm talking about. You know, he's clearly is inspired by things that are, you know, decayed. And I mean I haven't read his bio, but that's what my guess would be.
HEATHER:
Um and in juxtaposing your beautiful painting and your art, you also, I know you know, what you work for IBM as well and how, how do you kind of balance the workload and the like I want to paint all night, but I know I have to get up and be on a conference call at 6:00 AM?
RAYA:
Well, luckily I'm an early riser and I, I, I've been really good at balancing or like scheduling my time and trying to work in chunks. I find that early morning is really a good time for me. So I try to do all this stuff that's like creative. And so I, I would, you know, I work at home so that makes it much easier because I don't have to commute and I don't have an hour each day where I'm like, you know, sitting on the subway, right? So yeah. I get to work first thing in the morning with my favorite time, which is the, you know, the, which is Dawn that's when I'm allowed to. And sometimes I'm in a meeting and I'm painting because, you know, I can listen and paint at the same time.
HEATHER:
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And that, you know, working from home and having, you know, an easel right there in front of you that makes that work really well. That's fun. Yeah.
RAYA:
It's really nice to decompress like, after the day, like, like for example when we're done here, I'll probably, you know, eat some dinner and paint as, you know, just completely switch my brain to something else.
HEATHER:
Yeah, absolutely. And I think, um, so you were, we were talking when I was there a little bit about some more of the community art building and leadership that you're doing and working, you know, with the folks in Gowanus and everything. And will you talk a little bit about that and some of the spaces and stuff that you have now on the horizon potentially?
RAYA:
Sure. so yes. So along with the local community here in park slope, I'm also, you know, working with the Gowanus community and I've been spending the two years, I did the Gowanus open studios was in a, at a space on Nevins and I am looking to be part of that building as a commercial tenant. So it's being converted currently to a, you know, like live work also some people are residences, some people just commercial, but I'm going to looking to buy some space in this building and hopefully build a community and start doing some of the things that interest me out of out of the space. And you know community minded and artistic and creative, you know, and, and seeing where that goes. But yeah, hopefully this fall, hopefully right after I see you something, I'll have some news.
HEATHER:
That's cool. Wow. you know, and you know, for, for your the creative work, I mean, obviously with the painting you're using canvas, Brushes, what kind of paint do you use?
RAYA:
At the moment it's mostly acrylic and part of that has to do with my space. You know, cause I don't, you know, I live here as well. I used to work primarily in oils. I've been enjoying the acrylics and I really kind of feel like there's, you know, I'm not, you know, it's, I can get a lot more paintings done because it, you know, dries so quickly. But yeah, I mean I think the colors themselves have come a long way, you know, you're not, you know, back in the day, like nobody was using acrylics really. I mean back in my early days. But yeah, that's what I'm doing now. And you know, maybe trying out some different mediums. I'm also I've been doing encaustic painting, which is a wax medium and that's been really fun. Also kind of need to do it in ventilation. So I don't do that much of it.
HEATHER:
Right. Your neighbors would be like, what really?
RAYA:
If they only knew.
HEATHER:
Right. That you're firing,
RAYA:
I'm on my roof with a blowtorch, you know, melting plastic.
HEATHER:
Like you do like you do. Yeah.
RAYA:
As one does.
HEATHER:
Yup. Absolutely. And then for your, the creative side on, in the tech and, and graphics, what kind of technology are you using there? Like, what are you, are you a Mac? Are you windows? What, what programs are you using for all that kind of stuff?
RAYA:
I'm on a Mac and I'm mostly some doing UX design at the moment for IBM and I'm mostly work in sketch, which I so will work, you know, I'll do my wire frames and then pass them off to a designer so that way you know, we can all work in the same program.
HEATHER:
Right. Yeah. Do, do you find, are you using like Slack or teams or something like that to like the communication between everybody?
RAYA:
Yes, we, we use Slack you know, and of course, you know, email, but we have some old IBM programs that are finally past their prime that we're no longer using. So we're definitely, definitely Slack users.
HEATHER:
Yeah. Gotcha. That's cool. And for you and your, your brand and you know, for like, for people to get ahold of you, where should they look?
RAYA:
So my Instagram is probably getting a lot more use these days and it's, I'm at underscore R a Y a R T underscore. So rayart, but just one a. And then my website, which is Panimau dot com
HEATHER:
Do you find that with the art community and what you're doing as far as painting and selling paintings and all that stuff, are you doing sort of a bigger brand push or is it mostly through the, you know, open studios and that kind of thing?
RAYA:
You know, kind of everything. Being part of the community here. You know, just talking to people on my own and soliciting shows. I mean, the goal for me right now is to do, you know, like a solo show and getting ready for that. I have one show, I have a couple of shows coming up spring, April and may somebody's getting ready for that. But I definitely am always looking for new places to show work and, you know, get feedback so that, you know, grows into more work and more interesting work.
HEATHER:
Yeah. That's awesome. So my last question for you is the one I always ask everybody is can you pinpoint a spark or a moment, a person place thing that really seats you in who you are and where you are today and the answers range all over. But any, anything that you might want to share with everybody?
RAYA:
Hmm. Well it's probably several places. You know, I think I mentioned the childhood Rogers park apartment where we had our friend Jan, and she's definitely one of the first to encourage me and then Oxbow that, you know, being part of that and going into going to Columbia college for art school from that. And also, you know, in college having a few instructors like Mario Castillo. He's a Mexican artists living in Pilsen. Him and then I guess I would say doing another artist residency in Argentina in 2007, which was, you know, just incredible and being part of that community there definitely kept igniting. So, yeah, I would say those. All those places.
HEATHER:
Yeah. They keep having those moments of inspiration along the way with putting, it's like putting yourself out there into different places and with different people. It's super cool, honey.
RAYA:
Yeah, I definitely want to do more of that. That's what I want the future to be because I, you know, you have to get out, you have to get uncomfortable with yourself to actually, you know, get better at something. Some Times that means being out of your comfort zone where you are, where you're living and working. And I'm definitely thinking Japan is going to be, you know, hopefully in the near future I would still love to get to this get to a place to where I'm doing an artist residency there.
HEATHER:
Wow. Well everyone, Raya, you're amazing and your art is so beautiful, and I love it that, you know, you have this great juxtaposition of art artist and technology and graphics and UI and all of that and then you're such a great part of the community there in Brooklyn.
RAYA:
Thanks honey. Yeah. I'm enjoying it. Life is good. You know, all the things. Keep it interesting.
HEATHER:
Yeah, for sure. That's awesome. So thank you for being on the show and sharing your story with everybody. It's always fun to kind of get to know a good friend even more
RAYA:
Anytime. Thank you for having me.
HEATHER:
You're welcome. Everybody that has been another episode of the Mavens Do It Better podcast and here is to another beautiful day on this big blue spinning sphere. Thanks a lot.